Evolution
Thursday 5th April
I’ve been considering the question of evolution after seeing the Strange Maps evolution thing, linked by Henry.
It seems that in the US, one in three adults believes firmly in creationism as opposed to evolution (according to this bit of literature from the pro-creation lobby). There are a couple of things I find interesting there… firstly, the question:
Why do so few Americans accept evolution when so many people in Iceland do?
My initial response to this is that a proportion of Americans tend to be nutjobs, whereas Icelanders, while terminal alcoholics, certainly seem to be more together on the whole ‘reality’ thing.
But that led to a thought… I wonder if Americans have a propensity for not believing in evolution because they can’t imagine a time-span long enough. Icelanders have their epics and their sagas and their old types of writing and their runes and ice ages and thousands if not millions of years of history to think about. Perhaps a young whippersnapper like America just can’t imagine themselves far enough into the past to give evolution enough time to work.
I had to laugh on the Strange Maps site, one of the pro-creation comments was:
There is a junkyard across the street, I don’t see it turning into an airplane.
That is one of the worst cases of analogy I have ever seen in my life*. Junkyards don’t reproduce. The commenter hasn’t watched the junkyard reproducing over millions of years. The junkyard (assuming the two previous points were ok) may not evolve into an airplane, if that’s not the best survival tactic. It’s more likely to sit there and just evolve a plastic roof to stop it rusting so quickly.
But what would I know? I only have a science background to degree level. They must have brainwashed me, the pinko lefty liberal higher education monkey boys.
(* except maybe this one)
I wrote: “pro-creation lobby”
Pfft… imagine if there were a procreation lobby. That’d be interesting!
stu
5 Apr 07 at 12:06 pm
Bugger, I have a BSc (Hons); I’ve been brainwashed too! (Damn, the education monkey boys brainwashed me so good I use monkey for my name!)
UKCodeMonkey
5 Apr 07 at 12:24 pm
“There is a junkyard across the street, I don’t see it turning into an airplane.”
Can I steal this and use it as a lyric? It is genius!!
American’s don’t believe in evolution since they still have a monkey as a president. http://www.bushorchimp.com/
Rollasoc (Also brainwashed with his BSc (Hons) and MSc plus my CP & BSA)
rollasoc
5 Apr 07 at 12:37 pm
damn those sneaky ” ‘ ” messing up my grammar. It should have read “Americans” plural not whatever.
rollasoc
5 Apr 07 at 12:38 pm
“Can I steal this and use it as a lyric? It is genius!!”
Well, it’s not mine to give away… better ask Chad from comment 11 on the Strange Maps link
I agree… it’d make an awesome lyric!
stu
5 Apr 07 at 12:43 pm
Damn, I was hoping you’d say yes, then when I get sued I can point them at you.
rollasoc
5 Apr 07 at 2:00 pm
I think chad got it from They Might Be Giants anyway.
You may have a point there Stu, the Bible is older than the USA, whereas most other countries were full of people before they were full of Christians. Of course the Red Man doesn’t count, since he wasn’t a Christian therefore had no SOUL.
sweavo
5 Apr 07 at 2:37 pm
maybe junkyards are higher up the evolutionary ladder than chad thinks.
maybe chad can see an airplane or maybe he can see a car, maybe he can see a washing machine or a fridge…
(can you see where this is heading yet?)
…maybe if chad watches these things for long enough they’ll evolve into a junkyard just as he evolves into a graveyard.
mystic chad. he was sssso close.
henry
5 Apr 07 at 3:23 pm
Maybe if he got off his enormous fat american arse he could go and build him self an areoplane from the junk, and then maybe crash into Mac Donalds, getting rid of even more crap
Max
5 Apr 07 at 6:33 pm
Brings a whole new meaning to “hanging chads”
lordhutton
5 Apr 07 at 8:01 pm
I love the junkyard analogy. It’s like surrealism. It’s art. It’s so good that it’s Art, like a person called Art. Short for Arthur, like that king of the table that was shaped like a round thing. I am pro creation. I like creating things. I need to go to the beach and build a sand castle. King of the shrimps, that’s me.
plume
5 Apr 07 at 8:56 pm
I’m an American, Stu - but I think I’m also an old soul. Therefore, I see no conflict between “creation” and “evolution.” If the all-powerful, all-seeing artist/scientist/creator-type being flicks a molecule into the void with His great toe and sets off a chain reaction (big bang, if you insist), why is that a problem for everyone? ::yawn:: Pure evolution simply doesn’t account for things like…sloths. Which are not EVIL, in my book (poor creatures, named after a deadly sin) - simply unfathomable by anyone without a touch of ridiculousness in their sense of humor. (It’s usually giraffes that get picked on, but if all the food’s off the ground, they actually do make sense from a purely evolutionary standpoint.)
Your logic makes sense, but I think we’ve come a long way from the days of the Inquisition, really…huh, a European invention, that, if I recall correctly.
The Spanish were so much more adamant about retaining notions like “the world is flat” and “apples only fall from trees when G-d wants you to eat” than we are here in the US.
Really, though, you’ve got a point - and interestingly enough, Christianity is to the Bible and religion as the US is to nationhood. No wonder we relate so well. I think some Christians tend to forget there was a G-d (or gods, depending on your geography and cosmic/world view) before there was Jesus. Another problem is the tendency to insist on taking the Bible quite literally (when it’s convenient to do so), instead of recognizing it as a literary work. And for that, I blame the fact that our public schools are underfunded. We really need to do a better job of teaching concepts like “metaphor,” and “analogy.” Get over the whole “seven days” bit (seven days, seven hundred million years - what’s the diff?) and it’s all so much clearer.
And who wouldn’t rather claim Adam and Eve (who always looked something like Botticelli’s Venus, in my mind) than Neanderthal Man or apes? That’s just human nature - and vanity. Wait! Isn’t “vanity” a sin??
P.S. lordhutton, we don’t hang Chads in this country, not even in Florida, unless they are convicted of a capital crime in a court of law. I believe you refer to an unfortunate incident a few years back, where despite the heroic attempts of a number of elderly residents of the state to save them, a whole spate of Chads hanged themselves. The government has conducted extensive investigations at considerable cost to taxpayers and is blaming somebody or other which they believe to be based in the UK.
Holly
6 Apr 07 at 12:39 pm
Thanks for the comment, Holly. I was careful to only accuse a portion of Americans as nutjobs… I’ve met plenty and they’ve all been lovely, and had their heads screwed on.
It’s good to hear the view from inside
Hehe… I just looked up “hanging chads”… _now_ I know what you’re all on about!
stu
6 Apr 07 at 4:10 pm
Oh, I know, Stu - we’re all friends here, and it’s okay (we make fun of ourselves on a regular basis, too - not just the rest of the world). That’s one of the nice things about being a young nation - we don’t take ourselves too seriously (most of the time). Then again, we do get all riled up when others fail to take us seriously.
How like a kid.
Holly
7 Apr 07 at 1:22 am
I worked on a local radio station, in the UK, where the local Mayor was being interviewed. The interview brought-up the subject of Darwin and both the presenter and the Mayor proceded to pontificate on Darwin, stating that he withdrew all of his theories prior to death (I’ve never seen any proof of this).
Both Darwin and Galileo were attacked by the church. The fact that Galileo was asked to recant his views show how times have moved-on. I believe even the Mayor may have believed some of Galileo’s discoveries.
I wonder how many Americans disagree with Galileo’s theories because Chronicles states that the world is firmly established and cannot be moved?
Steve Robbo
8 Apr 07 at 10:38 pm
Holly’s got it mostly right, methinks. As a fellow Murkin - and one who lives in the Southern Bible Belt, no less and/or unfortunately - I blame the whole “creationism” on the book thumpers, most of whom still think that Hindus, buddists and trappist monks are in need of converting.
An informal poll I just conducted somewhat proves your point - 2 of 6 informally surveyed say “We are not monkeys!”. Strangely, those same 2 would have given a different answer 4 years ago, before they joined a simply gigantic baptist church and now never travel anywhere without their bible.
I would say “brainwashing”, but that seems too strong a word. If it makes ‘em happy, then that’s fine. Just don’t impress it upon those who don’t want to hear it. Me, I’m perfectly happy being related to slugs, algae, and Mr. Smith.
Cymbaline
9 Apr 07 at 1:57 pm
there are now 425 comments on that particular strange maps post
henry
12 Apr 07 at 11:34 am